MCN Interview: Michael Skolnik

Michael Skolnik
Director of Without
the King

One of my top ten films from last year was a documentary called The Devil Came on Horseback and the reason for that was not simply because the film was so well done (which it was), but because it was a film that spoke of the current atrocities in Darfur. Since that is a cause that I'm personally quite active in, that I try to draw attention to, I thought the film perfectly illustrated what exactly is happening there.

Then along comes Michael Skolnik with his new documentary Without the King, which is about the smallest country in Africa called Swaziland and informs me of issues that I had no idea existed. This film is an important one because as much as I try to stay on top of the problems our world is currently facing, this country and their problems was no one on my radar. Without the King, like the earlier documentary, is one that while it is a good film, it is more important because the subject of that film is an issue that needs to be seen and addressed.

Skolnik was able to gain unprecedented access to the King of Swaziland, which has one of the few absolute monarchies in the world. He is able to interview King Mswati III, who rose to power when he was just eighteen and has ruled for twenty years, and various members of his family, which is rather large. You see, the King has many different palaces across the land and in each one lives a different wife and his different children.

We are able to spend some time getting to know one of his eldest daughters from his first wife, a young girl named Pashu, who is off to Los Angeles to go to a small college. We see her in her palace, everything a young girl could want, and she is oblivious to the turmoil that exists outside of the gates, the squalor that most people have to live in; drinking water comes out of puddles and the only meat they can find to eat is throwaway intestines. She sees this sometimes when passing through to go get her hair done, but she doesn't recognize it. Her whole life has been spent with a blindfold on and it's only when she goes away to school and returns, that she is able to see how troubled her country is.

The King, for his part, seems like an incredibly friendly man; but there is definitely a disconnect in the way in which he speaks to the camera and the way he ignores the cries of his people. He is a typical politician, telling the people what they want to hear, while he builds (literally) another palace with money that could be spent feeding the hungry.

What I really enjoyed about this documentary was the non-flashy style that Skolnik brings to the proceedings, preferring to keep the camera trained on the people of the country and watching them speak for themselves. When Pashu goes to LA, there is a fascinating sequence where she talks to the people on Venice Beach, and we wonder: why doesn't she do this at home?

In a way, this film reminded me of Louis Malle's great documentary Calcutta, in the way in which it allows a lot of actions to simply speak for themselves. We watch a scene at an HIV orphanage (AIDS affects a staggering 47% of the Swazi population) where women are giving out pieces of bread to the hungry children and there is no judgment, just the hands reaching into the bag and giving it to the outstretched little hands of these poor children, dressed in tatters. Nothing more needs to be said.

Here is my conversation with the director, Michael Skolnik:

Noah Forrest: To start with, can you tell us a little bit about how you got the idea for this film? Where was your motivation to make a film about Swaziland?

Michael Skolnik: In 1997, as a college Sophomore at UCLA, I decided to study Zulu -- had always had an interest of visiting South Africa and figured if I was gonna go there, I should learn the language of the people. My professor turned out to be Swazi and was an advisor to King Mswati III. Over the years, I got the chance to meet the King, and when he learned that I made movies, asked me to make a movie about his life. I happily agreed, as I thought he would make an amazing character in a film. When I got to Swaziland to film for the first time (I had been there four times previous) -- the access I thought I had to the King was quite different than what I was getting. On day 4, after waiting every night for hours to see the King at one of his many palaces, I ran into his daughter, the Princess, in the parking lot. I had met her in LA when she was visiting with her father years ago, but now she was a woman. I asked her if we could film her and she agreed. From there, the film began.

NF: How were you able to gain such unbelievable access to King Mswati, his wife and his daughter Pashu?

MS: As I have known the King and his family for many years, the King agreed to give me unprecedented access to their lives. However, when I got to Swaziland for the first time to film, the access was quite different than what had been promised to me. So, I had to make a number of adjustments the first trip, the biggest being focusing on the Princess' life more, as I had much more access to her daily activities.

NF: I was surprised by how well-spoken and intelligent a lot of the folks in this impoverished nation were. Is the education system any good there or did you just pick the most well-read people you could for interviews?

MS: The education system in Swaziland is good. However, the young people who I interviewed all have various degrees of education. But, even thought some had a lack of formal schooling, passion will go a long way…especially when you are in a fight for your life.

NF: I was pleased by the fact that you didn't pull a "Morgan Spurlock" or "Michael Moore" and put yourself in front of the camera or narrate the film. You let the main players speak for themselves with the addition of some factoids scrolled on the screen. How did you decide that this would be the best way to present the story?

MS: My first job in the film business was in 1995 when I was 17 years old. I worked for Michael Moore on his first book, "Downsize This!" That man taught me A LOT. I am forever grateful for what he taught me. But, I realized during the year I worked for him that if I ever made films I would try not to put myself in them. I want to create dialogue not through confrontation, but through balance. However, I think Michael is as important to our society as any filmmaker has been in the history of cinema.

NF: I was fascinated by the Princess (Pashu) and how naïve she was. She seems to disagree with a lot of her father's actions, but still reluctantly defends him. I found her story to be an interesting parable for a lot of people in the world who know of injustices being done but choose to ignore it. Was that your intention?

MS: I am happy that everyone sees Pashu in a different way -- I never really had any intention of showing her as anything but the person she truly is. I think that the film depicts her truthfully and honestly -- someone who is conflicted and struggles to come to terms with some discoveries she is making as a person. That is human and that is something many of us can relate to.

NF: I imagine you might not be welcomed back to Swaziland anytime soon; do you know if any of the royal family has seen the film? If so, what were their reactions to it?

MS: I showed the film to the Princess. I will respect her and not talk too much about her reaction or the conversation we had after the screening. I do not know if any other family members have seen the film -- I hope so. I have been told that the film has been banned in Swaziland and that anyone in possession of the film can be charged with sedition.

NF: One of your earlier films, Lockdown U.S.A., dealt with the asinine Rockefeller Laws in New York State. Are you particularly intrigued by the ways in which impoverished folks are given a raw deal by various governments? Or is it just a coincidence?

MS: I am intrigued by people who do not have the opportunity to tell their own stories. I came to terms, early on in my life, that I was quite privileged and had every opportunity imaginable at my fingertips. I wanted to live a life where I could share the stories of all of the remarkable people I have had the chance to meet in my young 29 years of living. Whether it was the young girls incarcerated in On the Outs, or the family victimized by the Rockefeller Drug Laws in Lockdown, USA or the young children who are dying of AIDS in Without the King. It is the basis of my life work and I hope to be able to make more films about those people who have been forgotten about.

NF: How do you shape a documentary in the editing room? How do you choose the most important parts from (I'm guessing) hours of footage?

MS: The first thing I do, is I tell my editor, who is also my mother, to make it work! Some films we have 500 hours of footage and some films we have 75 hours of footage. However, the strange part is no matter how many hours of footage we have, we always struggle to make a 90-minute movie. The editing process is a very hard process for me. Because I have this elaborate painting in my head that I have to express to someone else (thank goodness it is my mother) and then that person has to paint the picture. I could never imagine a painter telling someone else how to paint their painting. It would be strange.

NF: Can you tell us about any upcoming projects you have on the stove right now? I know you've directed narrative features in the past, but are you interested in doing narrative features in the future or do you prefer documentary work?

MS: Lockdown, USA, which is a documentary about Russell Simmons and his quest to end the Rockefeller Drug Laws airs on May 5th at 9pm on the IFC Channel. I am finishing another documentary with the same co-director from Lockdown, USA, Rebecca Chaiklin, about Wyclef Jean and his mission to bring peace to Haiti. And I am going back to narrative features, as I am directing a film that Brian Grazer/Imagine is producing about Haiti as well. I am also excited to report that I have officially partnered with FADER Films and we will begin to finance and produce great movies in the coming months and years.

NF: Last question: what are some of your favorite films (documentary or otherwise)?

MS: All time favorite -- The Five Heartbeats -- After that, in no particular order -- Central Station by Walter Salles -- When We Were Kings -- City of God -- Rabbit Proof Fence -- Hoosiers -- Autumn's Eyes -- I Am A Promise: The Children of Stanton Elementary School (the first doc I remember watching) -- Eddie Murphy Raw (my dad took me to see it in the theaters) -- Malcolm X …the bottom line is I am FAN -- not a cinefile -- a FAN. I go to see movies hoping to like them…not trying to pick them apart. I'm too young for that, and most of my time is spent complaining about my beloved Knicks, so not too much time to pick apart movies.

Without the King is currently in theaters

May 21, 2008

- Noah Forrest